ChatterBank1 min ago
Gun crime
91 Answers
I know this question will cause a uproar amongst some of the AB subscribers. But first let me say that it is not meant to be at all offensive, or racist it is just meant to start a honest debate and to try and find answers. Having got rid of these necessary formalities here goes.
On the James Whale show on Talk Sport Radio last night, his topic was why in this day of increased gun crime, are the perpetrators mainly from the black communities? And why is it mainly young black males who carry guns? Is it a fashion item, or can the blame be put firmly on the shoulders Gangster Rap music? All other reasons where discussed ie under achievement, social depravation, role models, but no one came up with any firm answer.
I have thought about this and came up with a rather controversial theory of my own, but I have decided to take the cowards way out and not go there, due entirely to the fact that some subjects cannot be discussed freely and frankly.
On the James Whale show on Talk Sport Radio last night, his topic was why in this day of increased gun crime, are the perpetrators mainly from the black communities? And why is it mainly young black males who carry guns? Is it a fashion item, or can the blame be put firmly on the shoulders Gangster Rap music? All other reasons where discussed ie under achievement, social depravation, role models, but no one came up with any firm answer.
I have thought about this and came up with a rather controversial theory of my own, but I have decided to take the cowards way out and not go there, due entirely to the fact that some subjects cannot be discussed freely and frankly.
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If you're not wiiling to offer your own theory, controversial or not, how can you expect others to offer theirs. You have by your own admission picked a potentially delicate area to dicuss, so surely you should be the one to start it? Your disclaimer towards offense and racism cover you for any controversy and should allow your theory to simply be seen as your entitled opinion.
My perspective on this is that it is a 'respect' issue with young black men.
The concept of 'respect' (although in this case that may be confused with fear, as it was with The Krays) is an important one for young disenfranchised black youths and men. Time on their hands and a lack of any meaningful input into society through unemployment means a desire to overcompensate - hence guns.
The concept of 'respect' (although in this case that may be confused with fear, as it was with The Krays) is an important one for young disenfranchised black youths and men. Time on their hands and a lack of any meaningful input into society through unemployment means a desire to overcompensate - hence guns.
Plus they are so readily available, it's as easy as buying a packet of fags to get hold of a gun in any major city. Most inner city areas have large black communities due to further social issues, ( unemployment, poverty etc) and once one gun appears on a street, it becomes the norm and others emulate the first guy who wanted to be a hardcase, thereafter you get a street full of em, and then some clever dick uses them.
You don't see much gun crime in Harrogate or Malvern do you?
You don't see much gun crime in Harrogate or Malvern do you?
andy-hughes has nailed it.
I would also like to add that when I was a kid, it was knives, rather than guns, but whatever seems to happen in the US, eventually comes here.
Personally, I think that part of the blame lies with gangsta rap, but please don't fall into the trap of thinking this is a 'black thing'.
I could point you to certain areas near Manchester and Liverpool where you won't see a black face, but could see plenty of guns.
I would also like to add that when I was a kid, it was knives, rather than guns, but whatever seems to happen in the US, eventually comes here.
Personally, I think that part of the blame lies with gangsta rap, but please don't fall into the trap of thinking this is a 'black thing'.
I could point you to certain areas near Manchester and Liverpool where you won't see a black face, but could see plenty of guns.
-- answer removed --
Ha ha ha....Jedimistress...are you kidding me with this???
Please, please, please tell me you're kidding.
I'm black, and the most aggressive thing I've done all year has been to shout at a steward who threatened to take my camera off me at the Madonna gig in Wembley.
Seriously - who are these 'aggressive blacks' you refer to?
Do you know them personally, or are you 'dailymailling us'?
Please, please, please tell me you're kidding.
I'm black, and the most aggressive thing I've done all year has been to shout at a steward who threatened to take my camera off me at the Madonna gig in Wembley.
Seriously - who are these 'aggressive blacks' you refer to?
Do you know them personally, or are you 'dailymailling us'?
Ward~Minter
Gotcha...I don't fit into either of those categories.
I don't drive a BMW because, frankly, I think they're vulgar, and I did well at school.
However, whilst me and my partner share a nice big house in Islington, we're hardly high fliers...and I'm not that intelligent either (I didn't see the twist in 'The Sixth Sense' until after everyone else in the cinema was putting their coats on and slurping up the last of their 'bucket of Cokes'.
Ergo - I'm average.
Honest, there are loads and loads of us about...check out the black guy in a bad River Island suit on the tube. He's average.
Have a look at a crowd of Arsenal supporters outside the Highbury Barn on a Saturday afternoon...they're average.
Loads of us.
Gotcha...I don't fit into either of those categories.
I don't drive a BMW because, frankly, I think they're vulgar, and I did well at school.
However, whilst me and my partner share a nice big house in Islington, we're hardly high fliers...and I'm not that intelligent either (I didn't see the twist in 'The Sixth Sense' until after everyone else in the cinema was putting their coats on and slurping up the last of their 'bucket of Cokes'.
Ergo - I'm average.
Honest, there are loads and loads of us about...check out the black guy in a bad River Island suit on the tube. He's average.
Have a look at a crowd of Arsenal supporters outside the Highbury Barn on a Saturday afternoon...they're average.
Loads of us.
admarlow...
Oh dear...I'm going to have to be really, really careful here...let me just start by saying that this is entirely my opinion. I'm not trying to speak on behalf of anyone else.
I live in London, and for the past eight years, I've alwaysworn an iPod whilst on public transport because I cannot stand to hear the aggressive, inpolite and frankly stupid conversation of teenagers.
All teenagers
I will be 100% honest with you...the difference between black and white and Asian is fading fast. They act the same, dress the same, and have that same aggressive attitude.
My brother and I are polar opposites. If he moved in next door to you, you'd sell up and move house under cover of darkness.
However, if I moved next door to you, you would simultaneously look forward to increased property values, whilst also worrying that your herbacious border wasn't looking it's best.
I think it's incredibly difficult to summarise a very disparate group (because 'black' encompasses West African, East African, West Indian...etc etc).
It's also temptingly easy to summarise a disparate group of people.
Just re-read my post...very wishy-washy I'm afraid, but it's really difficult to summarise 40 years of what I've seen in London concisely.
Oh dear...I'm going to have to be really, really careful here...let me just start by saying that this is entirely my opinion. I'm not trying to speak on behalf of anyone else.
I live in London, and for the past eight years, I've alwaysworn an iPod whilst on public transport because I cannot stand to hear the aggressive, inpolite and frankly stupid conversation of teenagers.
All teenagers
I will be 100% honest with you...the difference between black and white and Asian is fading fast. They act the same, dress the same, and have that same aggressive attitude.
My brother and I are polar opposites. If he moved in next door to you, you'd sell up and move house under cover of darkness.
However, if I moved next door to you, you would simultaneously look forward to increased property values, whilst also worrying that your herbacious border wasn't looking it's best.
I think it's incredibly difficult to summarise a very disparate group (because 'black' encompasses West African, East African, West Indian...etc etc).
It's also temptingly easy to summarise a disparate group of people.
Just re-read my post...very wishy-washy I'm afraid, but it's really difficult to summarise 40 years of what I've seen in London concisely.
-- answer removed --
I totally agree with you SP on that kids are becomming more similar, but are they not all becomming a bit more, well...''black'' in dress, and language etc. I should clarify my thoughts really, from my experience this ''attitude'' as I put it is really with Africans, and not so much West Indians. This is from when I used to be a recruitment Cunsoltant for Benefit Assessors and Fraud Officers. BTW , SP if you have a decent sized house in Islington you are definatly doing well for yourself, don't be so modest!
W~M
Okay...on a serious point, you said something on your previous note which kinda backs up what I was trying to say.
There are BMW-driving wide boys, and you do, admittedly have your Peckham-living yardies...
But there are a growing number of black people, around my age, who aren't what you would call technically middle class, but who have asperations that sit outside the stereotype.
I'm certain that I'm not the only black man in London who enjoys a bit of Rachmaninoff on the sly.
Okay...on a serious point, you said something on your previous note which kinda backs up what I was trying to say.
There are BMW-driving wide boys, and you do, admittedly have your Peckham-living yardies...
But there are a growing number of black people, around my age, who aren't what you would call technically middle class, but who have asperations that sit outside the stereotype.
I'm certain that I'm not the only black man in London who enjoys a bit of Rachmaninoff on the sly.
-- answer removed --
admarlow
Yes...frankly, you're right. White kids and Asian kids are definitely becoming more black.
...and sometimes I don't know what that leaves the black kids to do. I sometimes think they should become more white...I dunno...by living in Colchester and study Jung at university.
Re: our house - the housing market in London is ridiculous. I'm lucky that I bought my first place nearly 20 years ago and built up a large equity. Same with my partner.
Sheer luck, rather than application of talent.
Now, enough about me, I'm really interested in hearing what anotheoldgit's view was. I'm aware of how much I've been hogging this thread...it almost reads like 'SP1814 - The Mini-Series'.
anotheoldgit - what's your controversial theory?
Yes...frankly, you're right. White kids and Asian kids are definitely becoming more black.
...and sometimes I don't know what that leaves the black kids to do. I sometimes think they should become more white...I dunno...by living in Colchester and study Jung at university.
Re: our house - the housing market in London is ridiculous. I'm lucky that I bought my first place nearly 20 years ago and built up a large equity. Same with my partner.
Sheer luck, rather than application of talent.
Now, enough about me, I'm really interested in hearing what anotheoldgit's view was. I'm aware of how much I've been hogging this thread...it almost reads like 'SP1814 - The Mini-Series'.
anotheoldgit - what's your controversial theory?
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