Body & Soul1 min ago
12 Year A Slave, Do We Need Such Films?
130 Answers
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/// McQueen's film pitilessly documents the beatings, lynchings, rape and brutality of a slave-owning class half-demented by its own moral corruption, and routinely reduces audiences to tears. "I hadn't realised slavery was that bad," is the comment its director keeps hearing. ///
McQueen admits that he didn't realise slavery was so bad, so does it do any good for racial harmony to constantly remind people of man's inhumanity to others that which happened nearly 200 years ago?
/// "There's been a kind of amnesia," he says, "or not wanting to focus on this, because of it being so painful. It's kind of crazy. We can deal with the second world war and the Holocaust and so forth and what not, but this side of history, maybe because it was so hideous, people just do not want to see. People do not want to engage." ///
What is he saying that WW2 and the holocaust was also not as hideous also, what about the slaves that the Nazis used or those that the Japanese used to build their railways etc?
Just as we see less films made of these inhumane historic events these days in an attempt not to cause offence or ill feelings, to the present day Germans and Japanese, perhaps now we should do the same with other similar matters which happened further down in history?
http://
/// McQueen's film pitilessly documents the beatings, lynchings, rape and brutality of a slave-owning class half-demented by its own moral corruption, and routinely reduces audiences to tears. "I hadn't realised slavery was that bad," is the comment its director keeps hearing. ///
McQueen admits that he didn't realise slavery was so bad, so does it do any good for racial harmony to constantly remind people of man's inhumanity to others that which happened nearly 200 years ago?
/// "There's been a kind of amnesia," he says, "or not wanting to focus on this, because of it being so painful. It's kind of crazy. We can deal with the second world war and the Holocaust and so forth and what not, but this side of history, maybe because it was so hideous, people just do not want to see. People do not want to engage." ///
What is he saying that WW2 and the holocaust was also not as hideous also, what about the slaves that the Nazis used or those that the Japanese used to build their railways etc?
Just as we see less films made of these inhumane historic events these days in an attempt not to cause offence or ill feelings, to the present day Germans and Japanese, perhaps now we should do the same with other similar matters which happened further down in history?
Answers
Slavery did not begin and end with the Africans in America, it has gone on (and still does!) since the history of mankind. It is unspeakably bad, but we should not feel that we have to bear any particular historical burden of guilt, more than anyone else. Africa has always been a mine for Arab slave traders, not only westward, but eastward too. The Turks...
14:28 Sat 04th Jan 2014
He's not saying that at all, but we DO need these films, to educate. The younger generation have no idea about what went on. The chap who is the central character in this film was an educated family man who was conned to a meeting then hi-jacked into the slave trade. It's a appalling part of history.
The slave owners did some terrible things and people may not know that. There are plenty of books documenting this unsavoury aspect of American history, but McQueen is attempting to tell more people through the pipular medium of film. It is a worthwhile subject, and the critics and the audience will judge it on merit.
It is a taboo story because the hideous things were done by their ancestors. It wasn't illegal so they were never prosecuted or punished. But it was morally repugnant.
He is not trying to belittle the holocaust, he is pointing out that many films have been made about that, but not much on the slave trade.
It is a suitable subject for an historical film. It is unlikey to cause racial tensions anymore than a screening of 'Zulu' would. People know this is the past and many bad things happened there.
Are you saying this film should be ban? Or never have been made? Why?
It is a taboo story because the hideous things were done by their ancestors. It wasn't illegal so they were never prosecuted or punished. But it was morally repugnant.
He is not trying to belittle the holocaust, he is pointing out that many films have been made about that, but not much on the slave trade.
It is a suitable subject for an historical film. It is unlikey to cause racial tensions anymore than a screening of 'Zulu' would. People know this is the past and many bad things happened there.
Are you saying this film should be ban? Or never have been made? Why?
-- answer removed --
Yep, can't wait, had this earmarked for some time (last October).
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It's had pretty much 5 stars globally by all the major critics/magazines etc so I can't wait.
The first film in my link may be of interest to you AOG, get out more and go to the movies!
http://
It's had pretty much 5 stars globally by all the major critics/magazines etc so I can't wait.
The first film in my link may be of interest to you AOG, get out more and go to the movies!
Yes but the question I ask is,
Do such films do anything to promote racial harmony, or do they carry the risk of inciting young blacks, when they witness vivid scenes of cruelty by whites on blacks?
No white film maker would dream of making a film of blacks inhumanity towards whites, why even in the film Zulu, even after what the Zulus did to the bodies of the dead British soldiers after the massacre at Isandlwana they then still had to be shown up as 'good guys' by their salute to the few at the end of the Battle of Rorke's Drift.
I know this was only a film, but the making of such films is what's under discussion here.
Do such films do anything to promote racial harmony, or do they carry the risk of inciting young blacks, when they witness vivid scenes of cruelty by whites on blacks?
No white film maker would dream of making a film of blacks inhumanity towards whites, why even in the film Zulu, even after what the Zulus did to the bodies of the dead British soldiers after the massacre at Isandlwana they then still had to be shown up as 'good guys' by their salute to the few at the end of the Battle of Rorke's Drift.
I know this was only a film, but the making of such films is what's under discussion here.
All I can do is quote George Santayana....
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
We may not have first hand knowledge of slavery...or any of many other events of the past. But we do have first hand accounts. To be able to read them,or see them brought to life via film, may insure that we do not repeat the deeds of our forebears. To avoid such subjects is to bury our heads in the sand.
"Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."
We may not have first hand knowledge of slavery...or any of many other events of the past. But we do have first hand accounts. To be able to read them,or see them brought to life via film, may insure that we do not repeat the deeds of our forebears. To avoid such subjects is to bury our heads in the sand.
I don't know, it seems to me that slavery actually gets brought up an awful lot in American culture - Tarantino was saying just a year or so ago that he was bringing an unprecedented dialogue about slavery with Django (which much as I like the film, is a rather absurd thing to say).
I think what McQueen's saying has something of the 'speaker's benefit' about it. Basically you pretend something is being swept under the carpet so you look really good for pointing it out. When in fact there's been numerous cases of people trying to get reparations for what their ancestors suffered. Americans do not appear to be ignoring slavery at all, and I highly doubt his film is going to raise much awareness.
What I do think, however, is that saying slavery has been ignored diverts people away from episodes in history that genuinely *have* been ignored and have a huge amount of relevance today. Not least the Opium wars.
I think what McQueen's saying has something of the 'speaker's benefit' about it. Basically you pretend something is being swept under the carpet so you look really good for pointing it out. When in fact there's been numerous cases of people trying to get reparations for what their ancestors suffered. Americans do not appear to be ignoring slavery at all, and I highly doubt his film is going to raise much awareness.
What I do think, however, is that saying slavery has been ignored diverts people away from episodes in history that genuinely *have* been ignored and have a huge amount of relevance today. Not least the Opium wars.
Not sure if that's aimed at me, but personally I dont' really care if it fosters division or not. If a film makes people angry, then fine. II think that's legitimate. And I don't share the common assumption (which often seems to crop up in British newspapers) that people just ape what they see on movies/videogames.
AOG
It is an history film. Its job is not to promote racial harmony, it is to tell an hidden truth.
Young whites will hopefully be shocked by this film as much as young blacks. But whatever colour they are, it will be clear that it is set 200 years in the past. The idea of making such films is to educate and learn from past mistakes.
If you do not want to learn, just don't go to see it. There will be plenty that will want to see it, and take its message on board. I wouldn't be surprised if it wins a few awards.
It is an history film. Its job is not to promote racial harmony, it is to tell an hidden truth.
Young whites will hopefully be shocked by this film as much as young blacks. But whatever colour they are, it will be clear that it is set 200 years in the past. The idea of making such films is to educate and learn from past mistakes.
If you do not want to learn, just don't go to see it. There will be plenty that will want to see it, and take its message on board. I wouldn't be surprised if it wins a few awards.
-- answer removed --
Slavery did not begin and end with the Africans in America, it has gone on (and still does!) since the history of mankind. It is unspeakably bad, but we should not feel that we have to bear any particular historical burden of guilt, more than anyone else. Africa has always been a mine for Arab slave traders, not only westward, but eastward too.
The Turks (Saracens) procured slaves from anywhere their ships could land and where there was little opposition - even as far as Ireland.
The Turks (Saracens) procured slaves from anywhere their ships could land and where there was little opposition - even as far as Ireland.
ChillDoubt
/// The first film in my link may be of interest to you AOG, get out more and go to the movies! ///
I don't need the likes of you to tell me how I should pass my leisure time, I stopped paying a fortune to watch some of the rubbish made today, I don't even watch them when they are released for DVD or TV.
Interesting at the end of the trailer to the film The Railway Man, the leading man says,
"I have done hating it has to stop".
Perhaps the same could be said regarding the continuous harping on about an ancient slave trade.
Forgive, forget and move on.
/// The first film in my link may be of interest to you AOG, get out more and go to the movies! ///
I don't need the likes of you to tell me how I should pass my leisure time, I stopped paying a fortune to watch some of the rubbish made today, I don't even watch them when they are released for DVD or TV.
Interesting at the end of the trailer to the film The Railway Man, the leading man says,
"I have done hating it has to stop".
Perhaps the same could be said regarding the continuous harping on about an ancient slave trade.
Forgive, forget and move on.
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