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Integration Doesn't Seem To Be Working
"Census figures show white Britons are leaving areas where they are minority"
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Would you leave your area if you found yourself in the minority?
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Would you leave your area if you found yourself in the minority?
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AOG
"As a black person, how would you know?"
Because I'm a Londoner, born and bred and I know my city.
To say "some parts of London have become no go areas for whites" is cobblers.
If, however, the poster had said, "There are some areas that I don't feel comfortable visiting", well that's perfectly valid.
Name me an area of London which has become a no-go area for whites.
Just one.
Absolute nonsense.
There are no areas of London with a 100% non-white population.
Silly, silly, silly nonsense.
"As a black person, how would you know?"
Because I'm a Londoner, born and bred and I know my city.
To say "some parts of London have become no go areas for whites" is cobblers.
If, however, the poster had said, "There are some areas that I don't feel comfortable visiting", well that's perfectly valid.
Name me an area of London which has become a no-go area for whites.
Just one.
Absolute nonsense.
There are no areas of London with a 100% non-white population.
Silly, silly, silly nonsense.
your usual circumspect self i see, well some agree with you some don't, and i didn't say that that there are large parts of the capital where you won't see a white face, however there are areas which i don't feel comfortable in at all now, which is what i said earlier before, and it is something that i didn't feel years ago.
I would not go as far as to say there are any large “no go” areas in London, but there are certainly small pockets where the minority of people would certainly feel extremely intimidated. Areas that immediately spring to mind are some parts of Stockwell, Brixton, Kennington and Camberwell as well as some in Tottenham, Edmonton and Wood Green. There are a number of London Boroughs where “white British” people are considerably in the minority. There are more where the breakdown of ethnicity in schools shows a significantly larger proportion of minority ethnic pupils than white British (indicating that the minority ethnic proportion of the population is on the increase).
Whilst em has rightly said that there are not large parts of the capital where one “will not see a white face” there are certainly areas of significant size where almost all traces of white British inhabitants have disappeared. If the London Borough of Newham is examined you will find that only 29% of the population is white and only 16% white British. 43% are Asian and 20% Black. However, Newham is a large borough and certain areas of it tend to contain people predominantly of just one ethnicity. If you travel from East Ham, along the Barking Road towards Upton Park and Plaistow it is very likely that virtually everybody you encounter will be Asian. It is perfectly understandable for white people, in particular white British people (who remember only make up one in six of the entire Newham population) to feel alienated by this. Not everybody has the attitude that the UK belongs to all comers and many feel that “their” area is being (or already has been) overrun.
All this reinforces the suspicion of "white flight”. The plain fact is that large numbers of people are not fond of living among people that are unlike them. This is not restricted to white people. You find Africans who hate Caribbeans, Caribbean’s who hate Asians, Pakistanis who hate Indians, Protestants who hate Catholics, Muslims who hate Westerners, arabs who hate Jews. The list is endless. Governments cannot legislate against these dislikes. The end result is that groups who are alike tend to congregate together. All groups are guilty (if that is the right word) of this and no government is going to prevent it (short of introducing compulsory relocations for millions). It’s what happens when large numbers of people from different nations come together over a relatively short period, especially when integration has not been facilitated or even encouraged by successive governments.
Whilst em has rightly said that there are not large parts of the capital where one “will not see a white face” there are certainly areas of significant size where almost all traces of white British inhabitants have disappeared. If the London Borough of Newham is examined you will find that only 29% of the population is white and only 16% white British. 43% are Asian and 20% Black. However, Newham is a large borough and certain areas of it tend to contain people predominantly of just one ethnicity. If you travel from East Ham, along the Barking Road towards Upton Park and Plaistow it is very likely that virtually everybody you encounter will be Asian. It is perfectly understandable for white people, in particular white British people (who remember only make up one in six of the entire Newham population) to feel alienated by this. Not everybody has the attitude that the UK belongs to all comers and many feel that “their” area is being (or already has been) overrun.
All this reinforces the suspicion of "white flight”. The plain fact is that large numbers of people are not fond of living among people that are unlike them. This is not restricted to white people. You find Africans who hate Caribbeans, Caribbean’s who hate Asians, Pakistanis who hate Indians, Protestants who hate Catholics, Muslims who hate Westerners, arabs who hate Jews. The list is endless. Governments cannot legislate against these dislikes. The end result is that groups who are alike tend to congregate together. All groups are guilty (if that is the right word) of this and no government is going to prevent it (short of introducing compulsory relocations for millions). It’s what happens when large numbers of people from different nations come together over a relatively short period, especially when integration has not been facilitated or even encouraged by successive governments.
there is absolutely nothing i recognise from even 5 years ago, nothing at all, sorry if that seems strange to some, but some changes are not for the better. All of our useful shops have gone, every last one, and now the place has that rather down at heel every other high street look, coffee shops, convenience stores and sandwich bars.. lovely if you are a passing through or need a pinta at midnight, the rest has gone the way of the dodo.
em10/NJ
Just because an area is predominantly of one race, doesn't not make them no-go areas.
There are areas in Wales (specifically Pembrokeshire, where me and some friends spent Christmas a few years ago). 100% white, and as far as I could tell, 100% straight. I felt in no way that it was a no-go area for black people or gay people.
Perhaps people should actually ask white people who live in Stockwell, Brixton, Kennington, Camberwell, Tottenham, Edmonton and Wood Green whether they feel the areas they live in are in any way intimidating?
Just because an area is predominantly of one race, doesn't not make them no-go areas.
There are areas in Wales (specifically Pembrokeshire, where me and some friends spent Christmas a few years ago). 100% white, and as far as I could tell, 100% straight. I felt in no way that it was a no-go area for black people or gay people.
Perhaps people should actually ask white people who live in Stockwell, Brixton, Kennington, Camberwell, Tottenham, Edmonton and Wood Green whether they feel the areas they live in are in any way intimidating?
em10
All the shops you miss would've gone anyway.
High streets are dying all over the country because of out of town superstores and internet shopping.
You could go to a high street in an are with a very small immigrant population, and the high street of 2013 would look nothing like the high street of 1973.
When I was a kid, practically no-one drove to a supermarket to buy their groceries. People shopped in their local high street.
As more and more superstores opened, people shopped less frequently, and bought in greater volumes (big fridge freezers helped that).
Therefore, the traditional high street of butchers, bakers, greengrocers, flower shops etc began to die, to be replaced by fast food outlets, phone shops, nail salons, pound shops, betting shops etc.
It's happening all over the country.
All the shops you miss would've gone anyway.
High streets are dying all over the country because of out of town superstores and internet shopping.
You could go to a high street in an are with a very small immigrant population, and the high street of 2013 would look nothing like the high street of 1973.
When I was a kid, practically no-one drove to a supermarket to buy their groceries. People shopped in their local high street.
As more and more superstores opened, people shopped less frequently, and bought in greater volumes (big fridge freezers helped that).
Therefore, the traditional high street of butchers, bakers, greengrocers, flower shops etc began to die, to be replaced by fast food outlets, phone shops, nail salons, pound shops, betting shops etc.
It's happening all over the country.
NJ
I agree with em10 on your last sentence. America has shown that people tend to ghetto-ize themselves.
Something else that should be acknowledged though is that once immigrants who take over lower cost housing in less salubrious parts of major cities make some money, they too will move out.
Few people will remain in rented or social accommodation when they have the means to move to areas with better amenities/schools etc.
I agree with em10 on your last sentence. America has shown that people tend to ghetto-ize themselves.
Something else that should be acknowledged though is that once immigrants who take over lower cost housing in less salubrious parts of major cities make some money, they too will move out.
Few people will remain in rented or social accommodation when they have the means to move to areas with better amenities/schools etc.
when i said as a black man how would you know, that was in respect of knowing why some white people may have moved out and their thoughts,
so you elected to make a point you do know, but i don't presume to know your mind on matters, so not sure how you can speak for them.
I can't move, but there have been times i would like some peace and quiet.
so you elected to make a point you do know, but i don't presume to know your mind on matters, so not sure how you can speak for them.
I can't move, but there have been times i would like some peace and quiet.
I didn't say the areas in Newham Imentioned was a no-go area for whites, sp. The white people I know who live there just feel as if they are foreigners. I live in an area where there is a fair mix of races and it's fine. I've asked the people in the areas of south and north London what they think of their plight (I know quite a few who live in both of them). Their answers range from unprintable to probably actionable under race relations law. Just let's say that not too many of them go out after dark (and nor would I if I lived there).
No, Weybridge is not a no-go area for black people. I have a Chinese friend who lives in Oatlands Park and visit the area from time to time. The area is frequented by people of all coours and races.
No, Weybridge is not a no-go area for black people. I have a Chinese friend who lives in Oatlands Park and visit the area from time to time. The area is frequented by people of all coours and races.
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