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Guns,campuses And Madness
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@jno and Eddie
Thanks for the up to date stats, although, at the time I encountered this (incorrect) factoid, the London population was quoted as being 11 million. I realise it is full of empty investment-style residential blocks now but it could not have depopulated to that extent with the immigration rate over the intervening years.
From the OP article
//Joan Neuberger, a history professor and one of the founders of a new advocacy group called Gun Free UT, told me: “If I know that there’s a possibility that someone will have gun in his pocket, I can’t in good conscience get students to debate the way they do now.”//
So there is an interesting juxtaposition of the first amendment (Freedom of Speech") being impinged upon by the second amendment (right to bear arms).
It's one thing to be able to prevent George III from re-invading but it is quite another to wonder whether expressing an opinion about some author/philosopher will get you shot, in class, by the gun-toting fanboy.
The same might, already, be said of saying the wrong thing in a bar in the midwest. You can tell I've never been there, because I'm opinionated, yet still alive.
Thanks for the up to date stats, although, at the time I encountered this (incorrect) factoid, the London population was quoted as being 11 million. I realise it is full of empty investment-style residential blocks now but it could not have depopulated to that extent with the immigration rate over the intervening years.
From the OP article
//Joan Neuberger, a history professor and one of the founders of a new advocacy group called Gun Free UT, told me: “If I know that there’s a possibility that someone will have gun in his pocket, I can’t in good conscience get students to debate the way they do now.”//
So there is an interesting juxtaposition of the first amendment (Freedom of Speech") being impinged upon by the second amendment (right to bear arms).
It's one thing to be able to prevent George III from re-invading but it is quite another to wonder whether expressing an opinion about some author/philosopher will get you shot, in class, by the gun-toting fanboy.
The same might, already, be said of saying the wrong thing in a bar in the midwest. You can tell I've never been there, because I'm opinionated, yet still alive.
@shoota
//The state cannot be everywhere and provide protection all the time especially in these days of ever reducing Police and defence budgets. //
Indeed. That is obviously because so many people hate paying taxes and contributing to Police services (and the rest) that they would rather vote for the party which offers them a tax reduction and delivers it *and* simultaneously claims to be tough on crime.
Odd, that.
//The state cannot be everywhere and provide protection all the time especially in these days of ever reducing Police and defence budgets. //
Indeed. That is obviously because so many people hate paying taxes and contributing to Police services (and the rest) that they would rather vote for the party which offers them a tax reduction and delivers it *and* simultaneously claims to be tough on crime.
Odd, that.
In 1939 the populations were G. London 8.6m & Aus 7m, from which point London's went into decades of decline (by 1988 was down to 6.7m) while Australia's kept increasing.
Around 1950 Australia's population surpassed that of London and far outpaced any future increases in the capital.
My cousin was a Ten Pound Pom in the mid 60s and when he returned to the UK in the early 90s he was trotting out the line about London still having a larger population etc. when, in fact, Australia's was already 50% greater before he arrived there and 200% greater on his return.
Around 1950 Australia's population surpassed that of London and far outpaced any future increases in the capital.
My cousin was a Ten Pound Pom in the mid 60s and when he returned to the UK in the early 90s he was trotting out the line about London still having a larger population etc. when, in fact, Australia's was already 50% greater before he arrived there and 200% greater on his return.
@Shoota
I doubt an armed person would have been capable of responding fast enough to a car, swerving, at the last second, towards Lee Rigby.
We have no way of knowing whether the car impact was fatal, either, so shooting the perpetrators might not have saved his life.
Had I been there, I would not have realised what was about to happen until the weapons were raised, leaving me about 1-2 seconds to decide to act, draw (from concealed holder), check no bystanders are in the background, aim and fire.
In principle you are right but in practice, I guess armed response is very, very hard to get right. I don't like the idea of amateurs doing it.
I doubt an armed person would have been capable of responding fast enough to a car, swerving, at the last second, towards Lee Rigby.
We have no way of knowing whether the car impact was fatal, either, so shooting the perpetrators might not have saved his life.
Had I been there, I would not have realised what was about to happen until the weapons were raised, leaving me about 1-2 seconds to decide to act, draw (from concealed holder), check no bystanders are in the background, aim and fire.
In principle you are right but in practice, I guess armed response is very, very hard to get right. I don't like the idea of amateurs doing it.
Only an idiot would support a law that makes it legal to have a concealed gun in a place of learning. Clanad's line seems to to that the latest gun outrage would have been less serious if all the students had guns !
.....so that is really what we need....a fire fight in the corridors of our schools and colleges !
.....so that is really what we need....a fire fight in the corridors of our schools and colleges !
I've said this before but what Americans need to do is to get organised...call it an Organisation of Common Sense if you like. The NRA and other commercial concerns have had it their own way for too long. Band together and make their voices heard...tell their elected representatives that things have got to change. We did it here and they can do it as well.
Much better to get organised than have candle-lit vigils and stand around feeling sorry for themselves.
Much better to get organised than have candle-lit vigils and stand around feeling sorry for themselves.
Eddie51, assume what you will mea culpa I didn't notice the date on my first reference but doing some follow up research I find:
Amazon.com User Recommendation
Apparently the John Lott study affirms the position explained in the earlier article. Additional supporting data from Jamaica, for example, indicated this for Ireland, Jamaica and Wales:
https:/
I'm not enough of a statistician to interpret the results of these studies other than to rely on what the graphs and texts indicate.
I found this especially informative:
Fact: Britain has the highest rate of violent crime in Europe, more so than the United States or even South Africa. They also have the second highest overall crime rate in the European Union. In 2008, Britain had a violent crime rate nearly five times higher than the United States (2034 vs. 446 per 100,000 population). 18
Amazon.com User Recommendation
Apparently the John Lott study affirms the position explained in the earlier article. Additional supporting data from Jamaica, for example, indicated this for Ireland, Jamaica and Wales:
https:/
I'm not enough of a statistician to interpret the results of these studies other than to rely on what the graphs and texts indicate.
I found this especially informative:
Fact: Britain has the highest rate of violent crime in Europe, more so than the United States or even South Africa. They also have the second highest overall crime rate in the European Union. In 2008, Britain had a violent crime rate nearly five times higher than the United States (2034 vs. 446 per 100,000 population). 18
pasta, as an ex-resident of the States, I have always said that the US will not change, the "A well regulated Militia, being necessary to the security of a free State, the right of the people to keep and bear Arms, shall not be infringed."
As you will know, that's the second amendment - even though one can quibble if there is a difference between the citizens and a militia.....to change it requires twothirds majority in both Houses and that is not practical as to changing gun laws. If I was Monsieur Obama, I would be looking at major federal tax increases in the bullets, shot and a specific sales tax on armoury - but then the Pres will need a majority in both houses to drive that through - they did that on alcohol though, in unifying the States at 21, using the interstate/Fed budget on highways as the threat though,......no money if you don't fall into line.
As you will know, that's the second amendment - even though one can quibble if there is a difference between the citizens and a militia.....to change it requires twothirds majority in both Houses and that is not practical as to changing gun laws. If I was Monsieur Obama, I would be looking at major federal tax increases in the bullets, shot and a specific sales tax on armoury - but then the Pres will need a majority in both houses to drive that through - they did that on alcohol though, in unifying the States at 21, using the interstate/Fed budget on highways as the threat though,......no money if you don't fall into line.
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