Dave Lee Travis Sentence To Be Reviewed...

[Jomlett]

Dave Lee Travis indecent assault sentence to be reviewed - http://gu.com/p/42xhn/tw

[naomi24]

The evidence is there.

[andy-hughes]

Naomi - "The evidence is there."

What 'evidence', and where is it please?

[naomi24]

from you: we'll never know [if historic cases of non-famous people are being reported]

from mccfluff: http://www.tamworthherald.co.uk/Pervert-raped-girl-aged-12-spiking-Ribena-drink/story-20802176-detail/story.html

from you: Correction - we do know!


Enough. Stop treating people here as fools. They're not.

[andy-hughes]

Naomi - "from you: we'll never know [if historic cases of non-famous people are being reported]

from mccfluff: http://www.tamworthherald.co.uk/Pervert-raped-girl-aged-12-spiking-Ribena-drink/story-20802176-detail/story.html

from you: Correction - we do know!"

How on earth do you make a link between this case and the Travis case based on this?

I am genuinely at a loss.

Maybe tomorrow when the day-shift come on, we can get some other input because I am totally at a loss about where your argument is coming from.

There is no link, I have not suggested that there is a link - so how do you conclude that I have? I look forward to resuming this in the morning.

"Enough. Stop treating people here as fools. They're not."

I don't think people here are fools - the outrage is all yours, not mine.

[naomi24]

Yes, you have suggested there's a link. Suddenly 'we do know'. You've said enough. I won't be resuming this with you in the morning.

[andy-hughes]

Naomi - "Yes, you have suggested there's a link. Suddenly 'we do know'. You've said enough. I won't be resuming this with you in the morning."

If you see a link, I cannot stop you, I can only reiterate that far as I am concerned the point I was making is that historical cases involving non-famous people are reported in the media.

I think I made that point perfectly clearly.

If you persist in seeing a link between that case linked and the Travis case, then that link is in your mind - and I have done nothing to put it there.

Your refusal to re-join the debate in the morning will save you from the tiresome task of thinking over what you have said this evening, and perhaps thinking that an apology might be in order.

[naomi24]

Think on.

[andy-hughes]

Naomi - "Think on."

It's a bit late at night for philosophy - do you have a point to make?

[naomi24]

This is astonishing!

[andy-hughes]

Naomi - "This is astonishing!"

I may agree with you - if I knew what you are talking about - can you be a little more forthcoming please?

[ludwig]

Is there a mod around to put this thread out of it's misery?

[andy-hughes]

Ludwig - as long as a thread is active, and no rules are being broken, there is no reason not to let it run.

If you think it is 'in misery', feel free not to re-visit it.

[ludwig]

//feel free not to re-visit it.//

Good idea. I'll leave you to it.
Off to bed.

[andy-hughes]

Goodnight Ludwig - see you tomorrow.

[askyourgran]

Andy your righteous indignation is beginning to pall.. DLT has been treated badly in this case. How many chances do the courts need to take their justice. DLT has been recalled to the court twice, he has lost his reputation his home and money for this offence. The man wasn't a serial rapist he was a groper, like several other famous chancers all those years ago. Women/girls had very little backing from the police or employers then, the outlook then was 'get over it', gropers were given short shrift but the penalty wouldn't have been as much then as it has been done today - 20 years later. Admittedly it is a very frightening thing to happen to a young woman. At the time it happened to me by some creep who wasn't even famous I daren't tell my parents I felt ashamed. I never told anyone but I certainly wouldn't have taken my revenge 40 years later. As it is the creep is dead now. For sustained sexual assault - as rape or attempted rape I agree there should be a stiffer penalty, but those historic assaults were par for the course it became common knowledge who they were and you avoided them.

[andy-hughes]

askyourgran - "Andy your righteous indignation is beginning to pall.."

I am sorry that you feel that way - my indignation (not sure if it is righteous?) is concerned with defending myself against an accusation that I have treated a case of sexual assault in a trivial manner, and I have been debating that issue with Naomi for some time. So I don't see where my 'righteous indignation' comes into it.

"DLT has been treated badly in this case..."

How so? He has been accused, charged, tried and convicted - I don't see what he has been 'treated badly'.

The law has followed due process as it is obliged to do - I don't think bad treatment comes into it.

[Obiter]

Far from being 'unduly lenient' I think the sentence handed down for one instance of groping was rather harsh. If anyone has cause to appeal it is DLT.

[andy-hughes]

Obiter - "Far from being 'unduly lenient' I think the sentence handed down for one instance of groping was rather harsh. If anyone has cause to appeal it is DLT."

The common expression may be 'groping', but under the law it is classed as sexual assault - and it carries a punishment.

Since hubris and arrogance has done nothing to help Mr Travis's case, he will hopefully go against his natural instincts and actually stay silent for a while.