I S I S

[mushroom25]

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-middle-east-27800319

The proud legacy of Bush and Blair?

[treetops68]

I beieve it was always a given that there would be cvil war in Iraq once the invading forces pulled out.

[naomi24]

//The proud legacy of Bush and Blair? //

Do you think so? Why?

[ToraToraTora]

So you are basically saying SH should have been left in power? Possibly but the underlying problem in the region is the same as ever. Slight variations in beliefs mean when they can they fight among themselves. SH temporarily stopped that but in the end this is innevitable, until the people can leave 7th century barbarism behind they are always going to be killing each other, better them than us. Just leave them to resolve it, hopefully in a 1000 years or 2 some sort of civilisation may emerge.

[Snafu03]

islam had been fighting itself the world over long before 1990 and will continue to do so.

[grumpy01]

Quite agree Mushroom and if these schools in Birmingham and elsewhere aren't sorted our children and certainly our grandchildren will see similar things here.

[ChillDoubt]

Yeah, all that trouble going on you'd think we need a Middle East Peace Env.......

Oh wait.......

[mushroom25]

sorry grumpy you've lost me. what has the situation in iraq got to do with schools in Birmingham?

[mushroom25]

Naomi, actually no.

I just asked the question - with the continued delay to the chilcott report it's kinda topical, n'est-ce-pas?

[naomi24]

The acronym ISIS stands for the Islamic State of Iraq and the Levant - Levant commonly interpreted for this purpose as Syria. (See the ‘Islamic’ there?).

//Iraqi officials told the Guardian that two divisions of Iraqi soldiers – roughly 30,000 men – simply turned and ran in the face of the assault by an insurgent force of just 800 fighters.//

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/jun/11/mosul-isis-gunmen-middle-east-states

Topical, perhaps, but while we’re worrying about history and the decisions that Blair and Bush made, I fear we are - very stupidly in my opinion - missing the bigger picture.

[grumpy01]

Presumably it has not escaped your notice mushroom but several schools in Birmingham have been placed in special measures to counteract the Muslim intervention in these schools.The point I was making was that if these hardliners can get a foothold in Birmingham they can get anywhere and before we know it we shall be having rival factions fighting believe me it won't be long.

[mushroom25]

Naomi, the world has had nearly 30 years to grasp the bigger picture. in 1988 (I think), Granada produced a documentary called "The Sword of Islam".

[naomi24]

Morning Mushroom, you're point being...?

[naomi24]

^*your

[sandyRoe]

Wasn't Iraq an artificial construct following the Great War? Sunni and Shia are like oil and water, give them a chance and they'd split. Maybe what we're seeing there now is a one hundred year old mistake being rectified.

[Gromit]

The formation of ISIS is more Obama's fault. They have formed in response to Obam'as attempts to topple Assad. With US and UK encouragement they have grown and been a draw for every fanatical jhadist dreaming of creating Islamic republics where stable dictatorships once ruled. The US and UK had a fantastic opportunity in Syria and they blew it big time.

Bush and Blair transformed Iraq from a stable secular dictatorship into a broken country, then they buggered off leaving a vaccuum to be filled.

This rabble of islamic fighters have seen at opportunity and have gone for it. We created them, and the conditions in Iraq for them to succeed.

American (and UK) foreign Policy in the region has always been chaotic at best.

[Gromit]

A good example of the change in language and tone.

When they were a tool to further our cause of toppling Assad they were the plucky Syrian Rebels.

Now they are Jhadist iIslamic insurgents because they are trying to topple our puppet regime in Iraq.

A lot of British blood has been spilled to get to this stage. Labour, Conservative, Republicans and Democrats (sic) owe the people of the UK, the US, Iraq and the world an apology for the mess they have created

[anotheoldgit]

The peoples of Iraq and Syria have very little to worry about because according to some on AnswerBank there are only a very, very small minority of extreme militant Muslims.

[mushroom25]

morning Naomi, glad to see you corrected your aberrant apostrophe :)

my point being, the bigger picture has been missed for far longer than just the recent bit of history currently being agonized over by chilcott et al.

[DrFilth]

aog for best answer

[Gromit]

AOG

I don't think anyone has played down the number of extreme muslims in the world.

Thankfully, they are a very small number in this country, but in Pakistan, Saudi Arabia and UAE the are the mainstream. ISIS are not from one country, is a collection of jhadists from many countries in the middle east and north Africa.