Global Warming

[Glidr]

Does anyone else think this is a con, I for one do. I know the Earth heats up and cools down over the centuries, I was just wondering as I was reading the " scientific " community was divided. I thought science was about testing testable facts, but how can you say the Earth is warming up because of pollution ? Surely Volcanoes, animal farts etc etc have been knocking out gasses for thousands of years.

I also found out " on the net " that the ocean absorbs most of our CO2. But I'm not a scientists so there you go.

I do agree pollution is a problem, so don't get me wrong. I just think this is a whole ploy by the worlds governments as a money thing or some other agenda.

I do agree that we could recycle but it seems to me the government and IT's scientists are basically saying the world is going to end.

As far as I know records only began two hundred years ago I think. So how do we know it's not going to cool down and this is all part of a natural cycle ?

I do agree with protecting the planet and looking after what God has given us, but it just seems we are being scare mongered into this " recycling lunacy ".

It's like the bodysnatchers film when they point and scream at you if your not one of " them ".

=)

[jake-the-peg]

No and nor do the vast majority of the Earth's scientists.

It is true that the Earth experiences variations in temperatures but this one is different.

When you look at the temperature variations in the past they can be accounted for by events we know about like increases in the sun's heat.

This one cannot.

It can only be accounted for when you take into consideration CO2 emissions.

Your logic runs only on ideas - you don't have any numbers and measurements in there and this only becomes apparent when you do the maths.

But most of us can't do the maths so we have to look to those who can.

You will find that there is a political consensus that man made global warming is a problem - Even the US Govenment under Bush agreed in the end.

There is a scientific establishment consensus - pretty much every major research institution agrees this.

And there is a overwhelming majority of Scientists that think this too.

Yes there are a few individuals that question this but then there are some individual scientists working at "Creationist museums" who'll tell you that the Earth is only 6,000 years old too!

[jake-the-peg]

Part II...

So how come so there are all these people out there who don't accept the evidence for Global Warming?

Well - horror of horrors - people don't make rational judgements on facts they make emotional ones - any car dealer will tell you this.

They look at the stereotypical "environmentalist" as a bearded liberal and don't identify.

Then they see that what they are being asked to do is painful - stop this, don't do that and they are often the sort of people who really don't like being told what to do

Are you one of those sort of people do you think?

And they react negatively and grab any argument however irrational

It triggers their "Don't tell me what to do reflex"

[Quinlad]

It amazes me how people scratch around on the internet for vague, patchy bits of half-fact and pseudo-science. And then crudely cobble it together in an attempt to dismiss a body of opinion held by just about every respected scientist in the world.

I'd be embarrassed to do that.

Especially if I was only clinging to my view because I found this 'recycling lunacy' a bit inconvenient.

[Glidr]

Quinlad,
My post did not mean to come across as negative. I am not a scientist, I was trying to say you hear so many things about this, then you hear some things on the news and some thing else where. As Jake said, normal everyday people can't do the maths needed and I was just trying to learn what was going on.

The internet is the greatest source of info out there, but, it's also the greatest source of lies too I guess. Also, there is nothing " embarrassing " about surfing the net and wanting to learn.

[Quinlad]

Apologies. It was a bit unnecessary.

I was talking more about the booming naysayers who refuse to accept the massive likelihood that man made global warming exists.

[jake-the-peg]

Try this then:

The Royal Society is the World's oldest and most prestigeous scientific institution.

This page:

http://royalsociety.org/page.asp?id=6229

Is their guide to the common misleading arguments put forward to why Global Warmining is a myth and why they're wrong or misleading:

http://royalsociety.org/page.asp?id=6229

Is not extremist but well informed and clearly stated

[naomi24]

I can see what Glidr is saying.

There's little point in the west recycling everything if much of it is shipped to the far east to be burnt, thereby exacerbating the problem of global warming. We are harming the planet, but unless the whole world stops doing what it's doing, man hasn't the slightest hope of combatting nature and reversing the trend. Whilst the environment will no doubt change, the enormity that is nature will decide the outcome - and it's arrogant of man to think otherwise.

Incidentally, I do think we're being fleeced under the guise of global warning. I'd like to know, for example, where exactly the extra tax on flights, introduced to help combat global warming, is going. Anyone know? I strongly suspect it's simply added to the pot with all the rest of our taxes to be frittered away on other things.

[sandmaster]

We do need to clean up our act. We cannot go on poisoning our planet. It is disheartening to know that our efforts are being wasted by what is going on in the far east, Russia and the USA but that does not mean we should stop trying.
But there is no doubt that the politicians are cashing in on this and raising tax income. Just today the local councils are complaining the government has not kept its promise to pass on the landfill tax to them in order to invest more in recycling.
Times and fashions change. In the 1950s the dustcarts used to have trailers to collect old newspapers. By the 1960s this had stopped and although many complained the authorities said it was uneconomic to continue to recycle paper.

[Glidr]

Sandmaster, I agree with you. It seems like the government is, for want of a better word, " forcefully persuading " us to go green and not offering us any incentives and also making huge amounts of money from us. Also I'd like to add;

I think this government is becoming more and more like Orson Welles' Big Brother society, constantly increasing the level of penalties for citizens who do not wish to comply with mediocre laws. We are letting this government take our rights one by one, until one day we will suddenly realise we have no more rights left and it's Hitler all over again.

Now, call me a pessimist, but history has proven man is hateful, destructive, greedy and arrogant. I have been watching over the last ten years what has been happening. More and more CCTV cameras for our " protection ". The government wanting to monitor our internet activity and constantly wanting more and more info about us.

And finally for f*cks sake, which f8cking idiot decided that because of the data protection act if my wife contracted cancer or any other disease, I wouldn't be allowed to know without her permission. My God in Heaven, I do believe we are on a sinking ship.

[jake-the-peg]

There are two ways of trying to reduce emissions

The first is a semi-optional way of raising the price of something like fuel

Where the money goes is not important - raising the price is not intended for a specific purpose like building solar panels

It's to stop you driving so much.

The second way is the mandatory way of just simply banning something.

Right now tht's not been used much (Unless you count 100 Watt light bulbs)

If the first way is ineffective we shall enevitably be forced onto the second way.

You will then find that cars that cannot muster say 50 mpg are simply banned from sale.

Do not be fooled into thinking that this is a issue with the current Government. The Tories and Lib Dems are just as aware of the pressing need for action and are as willing to do it.

I don't quite know how we got onto CCTV cameras and the data protection act from climate change but there's a major difference here.

Don't get sidetracked with other lesser green issues like recycling and landfill that is just people jumping on a green bandwagon - yes we need to be doing it but recycling your rubbish isn't going to stop climate change.

Climate change is not a political con to get more money, it's real, very real.

You can call me pessimistic too - because I don't think the politicians are brave enough to risk the wrath of people like you.

I think they'll fiddle at the edges probably for the next 20 years or so. Even when millions start to die, abroad at first.

Maybe we can get the Hydrogen economy up and running before it's too late.

But I'm not very hopeful